Star Trek (2008 movie)

TeeJay · 07 May 09 :: 09:35

Simon wrote:

Anyone going to see this within the first week?

Yes, today!

-TeeJay

TheCentralScrutinizer · 07 May 09 :: 15:18

I've always been a fan of Ebert, but he's been very hit & miss lately. His Fanboys review was a disgrace to film journalism in which he spent all of it trashing Star Wars fans. But his review of Knowing and his blog about it were pretty brilliant.

Dave and I are seeing it on Saturday. I haven't read any reviews of it and I won't until I've seen it.

Simon · 07 May 09 :: 17:54

You will have to let us know how it is without giving anything away. I'm seeing it next Saturday.

Illinoisguy1 · 08 May 09 :: 01:17

Now usually I don't care about a movies box office, but in this case I am because it's very important because further movies depends on this films success.

Box office predictions are trickling in.

Paramount insiders are saying 50-60

Other sites are saying 65 to as high as 79 when including the Thursday showings.

Total domestic predictions are from 150 to as high as 220 or so.

The unknown is the foreign take because Trek has never really been too big outside of the U.S.

Illinoisguy1 · 08 May 09 :: 02:50

Not to pick on Ebert, but I can't believe that he gave 3 stars (and a better review) to Next Day Air.

That film is being slammed fairly hard right now by the critics, which from what I've seen looks deserved.
But not surprising since years ago he gave one of the few positive reviews for the remake of The Honeymooners.

TeeJay · 08 May 09 :: 09:03

I hope you're not going to throw stones at me, but I didn't like it all that much. It's not a bad movie, but I had a lot of moments during the movie where I thought: Oh, come on, get on with it! I like a good action movie, but this was just a little too much action for my taste. I think an action:story ratio of anything between 40:60 and 30:70 is a good mix. This was probably 20:80 and felt like 10:90. To me, at least. Maybe I just wasn't in the right mood last night either, I'd had a long, frustrating day at work and went straight to the theater after leaving work at 7:30 PM.

I hope you all like it better than I did. I dare say most of the guys will, I think it really is a movie for guys more than for girls. I don't think I'm gonna watch it again in the theater. Maybe on DVD some day.

I can write up a few more thoughts at a later point, but they'll contain spoilers, so I'll hold those back for now.

-TeeJay

Illinoisguy1 · 08 May 09 :: 10:22

Regarding action in films.

It's something that's been somewhat lacking in Trek films.

Now this could all be due to budget restraints for the previous films.

1. The Motion Picture: Really no action to speak of. Well except for some photon torpedoes being fired at V'Ger or the plasma weapon from V'Ger, there really is no action in it.
2. Khan: OK a little more action. But no really spectacular space battles. The final battle between the Enterprise and the Reliant plays much more like a scene from an old WWII submarine vs. a destroyer film.
3. Search for Spock: A little bit of action. However the battle between the Enterprise & the Bird of Prey is almost over before it even begins. A few shots between them and it's over. Fairly good battle between Kirk & the Klingon.
4. Voyage Home: No real villain in this film. Just an alien probe screwing up Earth's weather.
5. Final Frontier: I can't even remember the action scenes from this film, well except for them firing a torpedo at "God".
6. Undiscovered Country: Fairly good final space battle between the Enterprise and Chang, but again plays similar to a submarine movie.
7. Generations: Way too short of a battle between the Enterprise-D and the Bird of Prey. A few shots and the Enterprise is disabled and crashes. Final fight with Kirk, Picard & Soran on the hilltop was ok.
8. First Contact: OK, the Borg come to Earth and all Earth throws in defense is a hand-full of ships and the battle lasts only a few minutes before they travel back in time. Should have been longer. After that it's basically just them fighting the Borg with hand phasers and such.
9. Insurrection: I don't really recall too much about the action scenes.
10. Nemesis: OK the dune buggy scene was somewhat laughable, but the final battle between the Enterprise-D with help from other Romulan Ships battling the other Romulan ship may be the best space battle in any of the Trek films.

So out of 10 films, I think only 3 of them has any sort of memorable action scenes. II, VI and Nemesis.

Now I know this may be a simplistic look at what Trek is about, but I've always looked at it as the military in the future. With the Enterprise being a battleship. I think any military based film should have a lot of action in it.

TeeJay · 08 May 09 :: 12:44

I didn't mean to say a Trek movie should only have minimalistic action. From the trailer it was pretty clear this would be a big action movie. And even though I knew that beforehand, I still felt it was too much. I'm not the kind of woman who doesn't like action movies at all. I thoroughly enjoyed films like (sorry, Deb) Transformers, Eagle Eye, X-Men, the Bourne movies, Minority Report, The Island, the Matrix movies and many others. I loved Star Trek First Contact. But this one just didn't feel ilke the right mix for Star Trek. Multiple times during the movie I thought: Okay, enough already, get on with it!

My other big complaint is that the story was very cliché. Good vs. Evil in a most unimaginative way. Felt like I've seen this a million times over, just with different characters. Hollywood is indeed running out of ideas.

The positive thing I have to say about it is: The casting and acting was excellent, though I had difficulties in looking past the fact that Anton's Russian accent was so obviously fake. Probably just because I know that he usually speaks a flawless American accent.

However, this might just be my own personal opinion and all of you might feel differently. I really hope you do because everyone's so geeked up about this movie.

-TeeJay

Illinoisguy1 · 08 May 09 :: 13:08

All I was trying to say is that Trek movies have sort of been lacking in the "action" area quite a lot. Even when they had action it was all too brief.

I've always felt in away that Trek films should have more action than they did. Something they've always lacked, so I'm glad that this one upped the ante.

Don't want to post any potential spoilerish material, but I think his reasons are much more understandable than what's been shown for villains in previous Trek films. Most of the Trek films used Klingons as the main villain and most of them were never really given a reason other than they simply hated the Federation or Kirk. Only II, Generations and perhaps Insurrection & Nemesis gave the villain any real reason for what they were doing.

Perhaps you can answer some questions, but don't post any spoiler material if possible.
1. How is the acting? Can go actor by actor.
2. How are the visual effects?
3. Any real "neat/cool" scenes? Try and be as vague as possible.
4. Any cool shots of the Enterprise?
5. Lens flare - overused - too much?
6. Is it easy to follow the action?
7. How much is Nimoy in it?

TeeJay · 08 May 09 :: 14:35

Illinoisguy1 wrote:

Perhaps you can answer some questions, but don't post any spoiler material if possible.
1. How is the acting? Can go actor by actor.
2. How are the visual effects?
3. Any real "neat/cool" scenes? Try and be as vague as possible.
4. Any cool shots of the Enterprise?
5. Lens flare - overused - too much?
6. Is it easy to follow the action?
7. How much is Nimoy in it?

1. I thought the acting was excellent across the board. No one really stood out for me because they were all good. I already mentioned that Anton's accent was maybe a little over the top, but it's hard for me to judge.
2. I'm not an expert in this matter, and I have to admit that I don't pay a lot of extra attention to visual effects. I will notice if they're bad, but I probably can't tell a nuanced difference between good effects and excellent effects. As these were done by ILM, I would say they have the usual high standard. I thought they looked fantastic. No complaints from me in the effects area.
3. There were quite a few neat/cool scenes, especially those where they tried to honor the Star Trek universe and its fans. However, I'm probably also not the right person to ask this question to. I forget things very easily and often don't remember details, especially if I've only seen something once. It's just the way my brain works. I couldn't quote any memorable lines from the movie to you unless I saw the movie again. Sorry.
4. Lots of cool shots of the Enterprise. I thought that was really well done.
5. Lens flare? I'm not sure I noticed much of that. Though I did notice that sometimes they had funny colored light spots in the picture, maybe that's what you mean? I wouldn't say it was overused, but I did consciously notice it once or twice. Why? Is that a J.J. Abrams trademark?
6. Actually, no. I didn't quite know how to put my finger on it until you mentioned it, but it's probably also why I thought there was too much action. But maybe that's just me.
7. Do you want an estimate in minutes? In percent? Put together, maybe 5 to 10 minutes, and most of it is in the last quarter of the movie.

-TeeJay

Simon · 08 May 09 :: 17:31

TeeJay wrote:

I hope you're not going to throw stones at me, but I didn't like it all that much.

Right, i have my stones ready.

Thanks for the little bits of info you posted. I think i did read somewhere a quote from Anton about how is accent was supposed to be slightly exagerrated or something like that.

Illinoisguy1 · 08 May 09 :: 20:48

Trek earned 7 million at the US box office on Thursday.

http://www.variety.com/article/VR111800 … id=13&cs=1

Illinoisguy1 · 09 May 09 :: 07:46

www.deadlinehollywooddaily.com

According to the above site Trek made 25 million on Friday for a total so far of 32 million.

72-75 million is likely for the weekend box office.

TheCentralScrutinizer · 09 May 09 :: 23:11

Just got back from the movie and you're going to have to excuse my language because I have to say what I really feel...

Star Trek is FUCKING AWESOME!!!

More later...

TeeJay · 09 May 09 :: 23:35

Haha, glad you liked it. Seems like everyone but me loved it, the reviews I keep hearing from others are all very positive. Which is fair enough, tastes differ, and I can totally live with that. I personally chose X-Men over Star Trek for a second viewing tomorrow with a friend of mine (who hasn't seen either and wants to see both eventually).

If Fanboys isn't showing in Denmark anymore when I'm there (in about three weeks), I might just go and see Star Trek with Steffi because she expressed her definite interest in seeing it.

-TeeJay

TheCentralScrutinizer · 09 May 09 :: 23:56

I haven't read anything you said yet, but I suspect your problem with Trek is that you are not a long-time hardcore Classic Trek fan. Dave and I are. We giggled, cheered, clapped and laughed our asses off a bunch of times. It was absolute perfection.

Obviously tastes differ because the general opinion about Wolverine is that it's just garbage. Dave doesn't even really wanna see it anymore and a few weeks ago he was all geeked up. I've always been on the fence about that one and only really into it because of Ryan and Taylor. And now that I've read how lackluster Gambit is and how they totally break canon with Deadpool, I've lost all interest. BTW, it's already been announced that the next X movie will be Deadpool. But how, after what they did to him?

Simon · 10 May 09 :: 00:02

Just watched Bring Back Star Trek here in the UK. For anyone who doesn't know about it, it's a show where they try to reunite the original cast. Walter Koenig comes across as such a lovely and very funny man.

Last edited by Simon (10 May 09 :: 00:04)

Illinoisguy1 · 10 May 09 :: 00:35

As of right now it's estimated weekend take is around 72 million, which is terrific news.

With Wolverine likely to drop to around 30 million, which is around a 65% drop, I think you're going to see a drop in theaters carrying the film. With Trek being the number 1 film this weekend those theaters will likely go to either Trek or Angels & Demons.

Now I have zero interest in A&D and never even seen the Davinci Code, but I'm assuming that those really interested in seeing that film is likely older than those interested in seeing either Trek or Wolverine.

Next weekend I think will be very close, but with the declining interest in Wolverine & the word of mouth getting around it's likely it'll drop around 40-55%, which would be a take of around 18 million.

Trek should have a smaller drop than Wolverine just had. Excellent reviews, terrific word of mouth it should have a drop no larger than 50%. I really think it may only drop about 44%. If that holds true than next weekends take would be around 39 million.

Now will A&D have a greater take than 39 million?
Code opened to 77 million, but I don't think this one will even come close to making 77 million. But it will be #1.
I think closer to 55-65 million.

So I think next week top 3 will be:
1. Angels & Demons
2. Star Trek
3. Wolverine

Then the following week is Terminator, which will take audiences away from both Wolverine & Trek, but the question is how much. I'm hearing fans are not liking that it's rated PG-13, the director and some of the clips they've seen.

But regardless I think Trek, Terminator & to a lesser extent Wolverine will be able to have some legs through most of June because there really doesn't seem to be any must see films released until Transformers 2.

Last edited by Illinoisguy1 (10 May 09 :: 00:38)

TheCentralScrutinizer · 10 May 09 :: 00:41

I don't really care one way or another, but I do think Wolverine will drop off the face of the earth a helluva lot faster than you're estimating. Really, reaction to it has been almost violently negative.

TheCentralScrutinizer · 10 May 09 :: 02:32

1. How is the acting? Can go actor by actor.
2. How are the visual effects?
3. Any real "neat/cool" scenes? Try and be as vague as possible.
4. Any cool shots of the Enterprise?
5. Lens flare - overused - too much?
6. Is it easy to follow the action?
7. How much is Nimoy in it?

First, I read the discussion up till now. I don't think Star Trek is about action. It never has been. It's more about how a unique band of individuals deal with the situations they're put in. The stuff of Trek that I love is the Kirk/Spock/Bones dynamic, which they very much birthed right before our eyes in this movie. Beautifully so. I think probably my only complaint is that it took way too long for Scotty to show up. But when he does, it's great! I didn't think there was too much action at all. I thought it was nicely balanced with the great character stuff. And that's what made the movie so much fun for Dave and I.

My all time favorite Trek of any version is the trilogy of The Wrath Of Khan, The Search For Spock and The Voyage Home. Those movies carry the heart and soul of Trek for me: the Kirk, Spock & Bones relationship. And they also have my favorite secondary character ever, Saavik. Though I think you have to read the novels to get why I love her so much. A lot of her business & backstory was left out of the films.

So, to get specific.

1. The acting is great. Everyone does a great job inhabiting these characters. I would happily follow this cast into future adventures. Chris Pine absolutely NAILS Kirk, without impersonating Shatner in any way, thank God. And I am totally convinced that Chekov's accent was deliberately over-the-top so they could play it for laughs. The joke they get out of it is as funny as the people on the street in San Francisco who looked at him like he was nuts when he was asking where he could find the Nukleeyur Wessels in The Voyage Home.
2. The FX are pretty damn spectaular. There were a couple places where I got really bad vertigo and had to look away because the heights were too realistic.
3. There are too many cool scenes to even mention in terms of character stuff. But I'm not completely sure if you mean other stuff like big set pieces or FX stuff.
4. There are many beauty shots of Enterprise. They go over her as lovingly as a gorgeous woman. I got chills from some of those shots.
5. The lens flare didn't bother me, but now that you've mentioned it, I might notice it more next time around.
6. I think it's pretty easy to follow the action once you realize that time is being played with quite a bit.
7. Once Nimoy shows up, he's in it a lot. It's not some throw-away cameo. He's a very important part of the story.

The best thing though is that it's chock FULL of in-jokes and references. Kinda like Fanboys, actually. So much so that even though I think I caught most of them, I might find on future viewings that I missed a few.

I've seen the aforementioned II, III & IV trilogy a million times. I never get sick of them. This one, I could probably watch at least half a dozen times.

TheCentralScrutinizer · 10 May 09 :: 02:52

BTW, according to this article, it has already made $31 million in just over a day in release...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/05/0 … 01001.html

It's already the best Trek opening EVER. And it's not even the end of the weekend yet.

TheCentralScrutinizer · 10 May 09 :: 03:20

As I was watching the movie, I couldn't figure out where I'd seen the guy playing McCoy before, but it finally just hit me. Pathfinder. A very bloody, very cheesy kind of mano-a-mano action movie about an orphaned Viking boy who's raised by American Indians as one of their own, and grows up to avenge their slaughter at the hands of the same band of vicious, evil Vikings who killed his parents. I got sucked into it on cable one day. Hey, the guy was hot and there were Indians, so...

Well, that nearly naked Viking was Karl Urban. And he's McCoy now, and I believe I'm infatuated.

TheCentralScrutinizer · 10 May 09 :: 03:32

OK, this is kinda weird and will expose me as the biggest geek in the world for the Trek films I already mentioned that I love. I warned you guys I'd be picking up references for ages now and another one just hit me. It's in the Kobayashi Maru test that we see Kirk take in the film, his 3rd, the one where he "cheats". We watch exactly what he described to McCoy, Saavik and David & Carol Marcus in the Genesis cave in TWOK play out onscreen. As young Kirk does exactly what future Kirk told us he did, he's eating an apple, just like Kirk did in that scene in TWOK, where his son, David concluded, "He cheated." And Kirk countered, "I changed the conditions of the test."

It's VERY obvious as you're watching this one that although Abrams wasn't a Trek fan before he started working the movie, he obviously studied it in great detail once he took the job. This is the kind of stuff that just blows me away.

TheCentralScrutinizer · 10 May 09 :: 04:35

Guys, I'm sorry to be hogging the thread, but I just realized why this movie works so well for me. It's kinda of like The Wrath of Khan revisited as The Wrath of Nero. Or Nemesis in a way. It's one guy, out for his own ends, opposing a Star Fleet officer he has a grudge against. Refreshingly, Spock in this case. Maybe that's why JJ is rhyming it so well TWOK. And why not? TWOK was really the movie that saved Star Trek. The Motion Picture could've killed the franchise. TWOK revived it and re-energized the story for two more very successful movies.

TheCentralScrutinizer · 10 May 09 :: 04:55

One more thing. The color palate. At the Academy, fittingly, everyone is a red-shirt. Meaning they haven't defined themselves yet. They're the disposable ensigns we saw get killed every week on the TV shows. Gotta have the red-shirts. You'll see a very anvilicious one in the first space dive scene and you'll know it instantly. Spock gets his familiar blue uni early on. But finally, once they new crew kinda graduates into themselves, they're all in that old familiar Classic Trek color scheme together. I love that!

Right now, I'm watching a special on The History Channel right now called Star Trek: Beyond The Final Frontier that's bringing some of this stuff back into focus for me.

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